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Post by sevensails on Jan 26, 2023 15:16:49 GMT
Hello all. I'm considering mechanics for the next HO games and I'd love to read your opinions.
The poll is open and can be voted on several options.
Also feel free to add to this topic other style not covered in the poll and "order of preference" as well.
Many thanks!
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pennmom
Bear
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[TI0] IT'S FIVE O'CLOCK AND ALL'S WELL
Posts: 16,570 
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Post by pennmom on Jan 26, 2023 15:58:33 GMT
sevensails, a little clarification on the fragment finds...Most love the FROGs that were famous in the Dark Parable series (and done well by Dragonseye Studio as well) so if the frags are frogs or similar that would be my personal pick :)
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Post by sevensails on Jan 26, 2023 16:57:46 GMT
sevensails , a little clarification on the fragment finds...Most love the FROGs that were famous in the Dark Parable series (and done well by Dragonseye Studio as well) so if the frags are frogs or similar that would be my personal pick  Cool, thanks! The matching mode also could include two halves of symmetrical objects.... |
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cbtx
Hummingbird
Posts: 150 
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Post by cbtx on Jan 26, 2023 19:10:12 GMT
I like the FROGS also when done as pennmom described.
And I can totally do WITHOUT Spot the difference ---- those pull down any game I see them in, so antiquated.
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Post by lurkercat on Jan 27, 2023 5:23:04 GMT
Personally, my favorite is one that is not listed, which is "place the objects back into the scene" - not nearly enough of those anymore, imho. Other than that is to find matched pairs, though I like the matches to be "related" objects rather than exact duplicates (eg, match 2 different musical instruments, or 2 different objects used to tell time, etc) - adds an additional component providing for fun "aha" moments. One of the best and most interesting HO scenes I've ever seen was in a little HOP game called Invasion: Lost In Time, where you were told only to find "unusual objects", where that translated to noting blue watermelons, an orange shaped like a teapot, etc....an innovative twist on HO scenes that was delightful in its originality and creativeness. I've never seen a similar HO in any other game, though I keep hoping someone will do so. Both that game and its sequel Invasion 2: Doomed (both by Itera Laboratories) had several unusual and fun takes on HO scenes that I have not seen duplicated elsewhere, which has surprised me, since they added very interesting dimensions to the genre & I would have expected more followup.
I liked frogs when Dark Parables came out, but as I've aged, find I like them way less than finding things that are actually big enough for me to see!
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Post by sevensails on Jan 27, 2023 10:14:55 GMT
Personally, my favorite is one that is not listed, which is "place the objects back into the scene" - not nearly enough of those anymore, imho. Other than that is to find matched pairs, though I like the matches to be "related" objects rather than exact duplicates (eg, match 2 different musical instruments, or 2 different objects used to tell time, etc) - adds an additional component providing for fun "aha" moments. One of the best and most interesting HO scenes I've ever seen was in a little HOP game called Invasion: Lost In Time, where you were told only to find "unusual objects", where that translated to noting blue watermelons, an orange shaped like a teapot, etc....an innovative twist on HO scenes that was delightful in its originality and creativeness. I've never seen a similar HO in any other game, though I keep hoping someone will do so. Both that game and its sequel Invasion 2: Doomed (both by Itera Laboratories) had several unusual and fun takes on HO scenes that I have not seen duplicated elsewhere, which has surprised me, since they added very interesting dimensions to the genre & I would have expected more followup. I liked frogs when Dark Parables came out, but as I've aged, find I like them way less than finding things that are actually big enough for me to see! Very interesting response  . I never heard of "Invasion", I'll have a look. Same with related pair of objects asking "two objects that tell time" etc. I don't remember a game asking this way. It reminds me a suggestion that sonia (username @eskarina) made about crosswords and hidden object. I like the idea of asking objects by riddle... looking into it. Thanks again :) |
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pennmom
Bear
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Post by pennmom on Jan 27, 2023 12:23:51 GMT
lurkercat, The Witches Island series by Itera is very similar and the mini-games are really good too!
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Post by lurkercat on Jan 27, 2023 17:19:58 GMT
sevensails , games that ask for "related" matching objects generally dont tell you what constitutes a match - they just say something like "find x pairs of related items" and leave to the gamer figuring out various combinations that might pair. I've got some such detailed scenes in my memory, but can't offhand think of the names of the games I've seen them in (there have been several such, though probably only a handful). When I get a chance, I'll scan my spreadsheet of games I own to see if I happened to bother to make note of that feature with any of them so can point you to a specific example (doubt I did, though). It is a clever and fun mechanism. Also wanted to note that I also like HO type scenes like "find hidden words in this scene", "find hidden animals" (either detailed or ala the old children's magazine (duh, whose name I forget...started with Hi...maybe Highlights??), and "find the odd one out". You can find some examples of these types of puzzles in the Spot the Hidden Image and Can You Spot these Well-Hidden Animals? threads on this forum...some specific posts in these threads are: thewoodsforum.boards.net/post/27309/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23790/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23830/threadGuess what I'm trying to say is if you are looking to make an HO game, there are lots of interesting variations on the theme and providing a wide diversity in styles seems like it might gain you more kudos than simply focusing on only one or two of the formats. Yeah, duh, I'm easily bored so love variety! 
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Post by sevensails on Jan 27, 2023 22:58:02 GMT
sevensails , games that ask for "related" matching objects generally dont tell you what constitutes a match - they just say something like "find x pairs of related items" and leave to the gamer figuring out various combinations that might pair. I've got some such detailed scenes in my memory, but can't offhand think of the names of the games I've seen them in (there have been several such, though probably only a handful). When I get a chance, I'll scan my spreadsheet of games I own to see if I happened to bother to make note of that feature with any of them so can point you to a specific example (doubt I did, though). It is a clever and fun mechanism. Also wanted to note that I also like HO type scenes like "find hidden words in this scene", "find hidden animals" (either detailed or ala the old children's magazine (duh, whose name I forget...started with Hi...maybe Highlights??), and "find the odd one out". You can find some examples of these types of puzzles in the Spot the Hidden Image and Can You Spot these Well-Hidden Animals? threads on this forum...some specific posts in these threads are: thewoodsforum.boards.net/post/27309/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23790/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23830/threadGuess what I'm trying to say is if you are looking to make an HO game, there are lots of interesting variations on the theme and providing a wide diversity in styles seems like it might gain you more kudos than simply focusing on only one or two of the formats. Yeah, duh, I'm easily bored so love variety! Find the odd one out is interesting and fit the bill of blue watermelon. In this case it should be "find X odd objects" or something hehe! |
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Post by sonia (username @eskarina) on Jan 29, 2023 9:56:18 GMT
sevensails , games that ask for "related" matching objects generally dont tell you what constitutes a match - they just say something like "find x pairs of related items" and leave to the gamer figuring out various combinations that might pair. I've got some such detailed scenes in my memory, but can't offhand think of the names of the games I've seen them in (there have been several such, though probably only a handful). When I get a chance, I'll scan my spreadsheet of games I own to see if I happened to bother to make note of that feature with any of them so can point you to a specific example (doubt I did, though). It is a clever and fun mechanism. Also wanted to note that I also like HO type scenes like "find hidden words in this scene", "find hidden animals" (either detailed or ala the old children's magazine (duh, whose name I forget...started with Hi...maybe Highlights??), and "find the odd one out". You can find some examples of these types of puzzles in the Spot the Hidden Image and Can You Spot these Well-Hidden Animals? threads on this forum...some specific posts in these threads are: thewoodsforum.boards.net/post/27309/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23790/threadthewoodsforum.boards.net/post/23830/threadGuess what I'm trying to say is if you are looking to make an HO game, there are lots of interesting variations on the theme and providing a wide diversity in styles seems like it might gain you more kudos than simply focusing on only one or two of the formats. Yeah, duh, I'm easily bored so love variety! Find the odd one out is interesting and fit the bill of blue watermelon. In this case it should be "find X odd objects" or something hehe! I, too, would like to see HO games where the items are related and complement each other - like a brush with an artist's palette, a gun with a bullet, etc. |
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Post by sonia (username @eskarina) on Feb 8, 2023 12:29:05 GMT
posting to bring this thread up - hoping more people will vote  |
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Jo
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Posts: 2,024
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Post by Jo on Feb 8, 2023 17:35:22 GMT
I haven't answered this question before because I don't even like hidden object scenes. HOs are something I'm forced to endure to complete a HOPA (I've played hundreds of the darn things) when all I'm really interested in the the P and the A.
That being said, if you had added "All of the above" to your poll, I would have happily voted. Give me some variety. Mix it up with all of the suggestions other Woodsies have made. Surprise me so I don't groan out loud when I see yet another HO written list. In some HOPA from years ago, can't remember which game now, the HOS was in the roots of a tree. I could see a couple of the objects on the list but I couldn't get to them because of a tree root. I had to leave the scene and go elsewhere in the game to find a saw to finish it. How clever was that?!?! It made it much more realistic and interesting than conveniently finding a saw in the scene and much more of a challenge to me, the player. because I had to think outside of the box. I've only ever seen this mechanic once since 2007 when I joined BF.
That being said #2, my favorite hidden object scenes are what I like to call "one thing leads to another". You have a silhouette list. One of them is a key. You find the key and it opens a chest. Inside is a crown. You finally figure out that you have to put it on the frog (Frog Prince, wink, wink) and the frog gives you a pencil. You use the pencil to finish a Tic tac toe on the wall and the plaster falls off to reveal a tile for a little puzzle and so on and so on. Throw in a few puzzles to liven it up and I'm a reasonably happy camper. I love the thing that 5BN does or used to do with HOPAs. The HOS is a new room and after you complete the HOS, you can actually go into the room and search it. They did this in one of the New York Mysteries games on the roof of a building with great success.
I don't mind using words I, as an American, may not be familiar with. I remember the hoopla on the old BF forums years ago about the use of the word "torch" in a game. Recently in Lost Lands: Sand Captivity, two words were "fly agaric" and "novlerch". I had no idea what they meant but I rose to the challenge and enjoyed the heck out of it. I didn't know what a carabiner or a katana was before I started playing HOPAs. I don't mind the use of homonyms. It just takes me a little longer to find a violin bow than a ribbon bow.
So the whole point of this is: Challenge me. Don't bore me to tears! Adults are playing these games and appreciate something more demanding that an I Spy book. Or at least I do.
Note: The above opinion is mine and mine alone. I take full responsibility for the fact than no one else may agree with me and that's okay by me.
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pennmom
Bear
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[TI0] IT'S FIVE O'CLOCK AND ALL'S WELL
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Post by pennmom on Feb 8, 2023 21:52:49 GMT
sevensails, I really liked the HOs that were offered in Moontrain and Out of Time because they didn't have an explanation, you had to figure them out which was more like a puzzle. I particularly like the FROG that was showing hints in Moontrain and the Bubblegum machine in Out of Time where you had to figure out that you needed to find coins to buy a piece of bubblegum and it showed a picture x3, once you found those objects you would have to find another coin and so forth. There were a ton of reviews that stated how much they loved the uniqueness of those HOs and the fact that there weren't any instructions, you had to fiddle with the scene to figure them out Now in all honesty, Five BN Games has the best HOs hands down...but they are probably the hardest ones to solve (Progressive-Interactive HOs) I hate searching for "clickables" most objects stick out like a sore thumb (especially Elephant Games HOs) I want them to be well-blended and prefer to have to solve things as I go, like the Five BN progressive interactive puzzles where you find an object and use that object interactively to find the next, and so forth
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Post by sevensails on Feb 9, 2023 10:54:54 GMT
I haven't answered this question before because I don't even like hidden object scenes. HOs are something I'm forced to endure to complete a HOPA (I've played hundreds of the darn things) when all I'm really interested in the the P and the A.
That being said, if you had added "All of the above" to your poll, I would have happily voted. Give me some variety. Mix it up with all of the suggestions other Woodsies have made. Surprise me so I don't groan out loud when I see yet another HO written list. In some HOPA from years ago, can't remember which game now, the HOS was in the roots of a tree. I could see a couple of the objects on the list but I couldn't get to them because of a tree root. I had to leave the scene and go elsewhere in the game to find a saw to finish it. How clever was that?!?! It made it much more realistic and interesting than conveniently finding a saw in the scene and much more of a challenge to me, the player. because I had to think outside of the box. I've only ever seen this mechanic once since 2007 when I joined BF.
That being said #2, my favorite hidden object scenes are what I like to call "one thing leads to another". You have a silhouette list. One of them is a key. You find the key and it opens a chest. Inside is a crown. You finally figure out that you have to put it on the frog (Frog Prince, wink, wink) and the frog gives you a pencil. You use the pencil to finish a Tic tac toe on the wall and the plaster falls off to reveal a tile for a little puzzle and so on and so on. Throw in a few puzzles to liven it up and I'm a reasonably happy camper. I love the thing that 5BN does or used to do with HOPAs. The HOS is a new room and after you complete the HOS, you can actually go into the room and search it. They did this in one of the New York Mysteries games on the roof of a building with great success.
I don't mind using words I, as an American, may not be familiar with. I remember the hoopla on the old BF forums years ago about the use of the word "torch" in a game. Recently in Lost Lands: Sand Captivity, two words were "fly agaric" and "novlerch". I had no idea what they meant but I rose to the challenge and enjoyed the heck out of it. I didn't know what a carabiner or a katana was before I started playing HOPAs. I don't mind the use of homonyms. It just takes me a little longer to find a violin bow than a ribbon bow.
So the whole point of this is: Challenge me. Don't bore me to tears! Adults are playing these games and appreciate something more demanding that an I Spy book. Or at least I do.
Note: The above opinion is mine and mine alone. I take full responsibility for the fact than no one else may agree with me and that's okay by me.
Thanks for your response Jo, much appreciated. Talking about I Spy, have you played the I SPY Mystery on Big Fish? sonia (username @eskarina) suggested Riddle hidden objects as a favorite. I imagine this would be fun for you too since it makes you think a little more to solve. How about you pennmom? |
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Jo
Skunk
Forest Ranger
Posts: 2,024
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Post by Jo on Feb 9, 2023 14:51:43 GMT
Yes, I have! Numerous times with the grandkids. The I Spy games are great because they read the HO list aloud so the kid doesn't even have to know how to read to play them. They're colorful, well presented and challenging. I own two at BF... And two in the box... The favorite for the grandsons was Fantasy because it has a dragon.
I very much recommend these games and very much recommend playing them with your favorite kids. My  is full of gamers started at a young age and still going strong. Now my 12 year old grandson is on Steam recommending games to me and teaching me things about Steam that I didn't know like the value of foil trading cards. Viva la gaming!
ETA: I agree with Sonia. The riddle HOs are great. 5BN even used a Sophocles brainteaser (What animal walks on four feet in the morning, two at noon, and three in the evening?) in one of their games - Sand Captivity I think. The more riddles the better!
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pennmom
Bear
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[TI0] IT'S FIVE O'CLOCK AND ALL'S WELL
Posts: 16,570
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Post by pennmom on Feb 9, 2023 15:04:38 GMT
sevensails, I like Riddles but not the stupid obvious ones, as long as I have to think about it for a moment at least You should have fellow Woodsy's suggest different riddles, get them involved...I bet a lot of them would love to see their name as a "thanks to" in the Credits and would love to be a part of it's development, you could open a thread under the Developers Den section OR I would be more than happy to create a new board for developers to open threads for Game Help & Suggestions or something to that effect where any dev can start a new thread
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pennmom
Bear
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Post by pennmom on Feb 9, 2023 23:06:05 GMT
Ya guys remember the older games where piles of junk were spewn about in the corner of a yard, playground, old buildings, graveyards, etc. yet they still managed to hide things in plain sight?
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Post by sevensails on Feb 10, 2023 11:22:25 GMT
Yeah, the complications with riddles is that hundreds would be needed. I imagine some objects would be hard to come up with really good riddles. Definitely will invite people to get involved pennmom let me know if you remember the name of that game. |
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pennmom
Bear
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[TI0] IT'S FIVE O'CLOCK AND ALL'S WELL
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Post by pennmom on Feb 10, 2023 18:18:48 GMT
Yeah, the complications with riddles is that hundreds would be needed. I imagine some objects would be hard to come up with really good riddles. Definitely will invite people get invited pennmom let me know if you remember the name of that game. Which game, the one with things hidden in plain site? Enigmatic: The Ghosts of Maple Creek is a good example Abandoned: Chestnut Lodge
Dark Dimensions: City of Fog |
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Post by sevensails on Feb 10, 2023 23:32:03 GMT
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. I never heard of "Invasion", I'll have a look. Same with related pair of objects asking "two objects that tell time" etc. I don't remember a game asking this way. It reminds me a suggestion that 
is full of gamers started at a young age and still going strong. Now my 12 year old grandson is on Steam recommending games to me and teaching me things about Steam that I didn't know like the value of foil trading cards. Viva la gaming!